Eternal Security Once saved always saved refuted

Biblical Answers to Common Questions

             About Eternal Security                 

UES-"Satan cannot get into my heart since it is covered by the blood of Jesus. To do so, the devil must pass through His blood to get to my heart, and we all know that's not going to happen."

EVG TV -   Answer: This is part of a rebuke I recently received. It would be laughable if it was not so pathetic. Does the writer actually think that physical blood is covering their heart? It will suffice to say that this strange and unbiblical notion sounds logical, but all it can do for the thinking Christian is to teach them that you can get some people to believe ANYTHING if it is preached enough. With this ANYTHING I place the belief of an unconditional eternal security.

UES-"You have gone to such great lengths to try and prove that Christ’s work was not eternal and that we can lose our Christianity, unfortunately, like many others, you now cannot tell us when we lose our salvation or how we regain our salvation when Scripture clearly indicates that once lost it can never be regained.

EVG TV -   Answer: I will attempt to answer this emotional, but kind response to my comments on a believers security. The writer forces his erroneous thoughts about salvation upon what he believes I have written. Where have I tried to "prove that Christ’s work is not eternal?" The writer’s preconceptions indicate that he equates the loss of salvation with a failure of Christ’s atonement. This confuses the provision of Christ with the idea that the atonement was a payment. Such a statement cannot be found in all the Scriptures. To assure all who read this, I believe in the once for all final atonement of Christ. He is never to die again! What I do assert is that the atonement is a provision that makes salvation available to all, while at the same time asserting that no individual’s eternity was set at the cross apart from their future trust in the work of Christ and their continued and final perseverance in the faith, which is the condition of the application of the atonement.

UES- The second part of the statement poses the question: "you now cannot tell us when we lose our salvation or how we regain our salvation when Scripture clearly indicates that once lost it can never be regained."

EVG TV -   Answer: Whether I can indicate how salvation can be lost and regained is irrelevant to the primary issue. Even if I could not elaborate on how this would occur does not prove anything.

The possibility of forfeiting the gift of God once it has been received is clearly and indisputably established in the Scriptures. But to answer his concerns, let me be clear that salvation is received on the present tense condition of faith. This is true whether it is initial salvation or present salvation. Sin is unbelief; it is anti-faith. Confession and repentance are requirements of reconciliation. "If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." 1 John 1:9.

To say that "Scripture clearly indicates that once lost it can never be regained." This is based upon one sole misinterpreted passage, Hebrews 6:4-6. This says nothing of the sort as has been proven in the comments of Mr. Charles Stanley’s assertion, and the comments upon this same verse in this section. The fact is one sin that one has not repented of will bring eternal Death. For the wages of sin is death.

UES-"You are so anxious to prove that your salvation depends on you when in reality all you can ever do is accept or reject it. We are carnal by nature, we are never good enough or righteous enough only by having the imputed righteousness of Christ are we ever able to be saved and that is not something we put on and take off like a coat.

EVG TV -   Answer: I believe that the idea that all we can do is accept or reject salvation is a half-truth that cannot be proven from Scripture. It is hard to argue with someone’s beliefs, no matter how flawed and unfounded, since they are believed as truths. It is as if I must beat the air to fight against something that does not exist with Scriptural evidence.

I will go along with the idea that we either accept or reject salvation. This however, is not an isolated act of the past, but a continuous act of every individual.

We can make a decisive act of belief that moves us into a state of regeneration, but this cannot refute and discount the fact that without exception, the Bible always uses the present tense when it refers to faith as a condition of final salvation.

UES-""We are carnal by nature, we are never good enough or righteous enough."

EVG TV -   Answer: I have never contended for, or implied that anyone could merit salvation. It is clear that the writer who has taken the time to criticize my comments has never even read them! He could not make these accusations if he had done so.

As to his comment, " We are carnal by nature." Paul describes a unique situation in a pagan environment in Corinth that seems to deny the idea of conversion and regeneration. The Corinthians to whom Paul writes, were Christians, but to Paul's amazement, they were ignorant of the morals and standards that were associated with the worship of God. They tolerated one who was an open fornicator, "It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father wife." (1 Cor. 5:1). Paul continues to be astonished by their ignorance of a common moral code saying, "did you not know?" (1 Cor. 5:6; 6:9; 6:15,16,19; 9:13; 2 Cor. 5:5.), and, "I would not have you ignorant," (1 Cor. 10:1; 12:1),"Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame." (15:34.) These verses show their limited exposure and light to the laws and morality of God. They did not have the basic moral knowledge and background of those that were Jewish converts to Christianity. They were not to remain carnal, but were to move forward as they had light! These "carnal" Christians had little light, and they are thereby judged by that light. They were not knowingly disobeying God, but were sinning in ignorance. This marks the difference between "carnal " Christians in Corinth, and so-called "sinning saints" who know the law of God and rebel against it anyway.  

To apply this carnality to Christians today when they are brought up in an environment where we generally know the values of God in our nation, just does not add up. We have much more light, and the Scriptures to know for ourselves. To say that we remain carnal is a denial that Jesus came to save us from our sins. Matthew 1:21.

It is to contend for a conversionless-conversion. It says that God is too weak to change a person and that the atonement of Christ is a failure. This powerless "gospel" is the reason why our churches are filled with people who are Christians in name only. " Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning.

For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.......In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God." 1 John 3:7-10. When we are born-again we have a new nature, we have been changed. Those who are not changed, and do not adjust their living in accordance to the light that they receive, have never been born-again.       

UES-"This letter asserts that the, "only by having the imputed righteousness of Christ are we ever able to be saved."

EVG TV -   Answer: No one ever has, or ever will "have" the "imputed righteousness of Christ." This terminology and concept of a transfer of character is unfounded and foreign to the Scriptures. This is one of those ecclesiastical and theological sayings that is used so much that those who do not validate their beliefs by the Scriptures are easily swayed to believe that it is Biblical. It is not! You can find it in their theology books, but you will not find it in the Bible! The writer says that this imputation "is not something we put on and take off like a coat." To this I agree. You cannot take a myth and put it off and on like a coat.

UES-"The Bible tells us that salvation is a GIFT of God, and you cannot lose that gift! "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the GIFT of God." And "the gifts and calling of God are without repentance."

EVG TV -   Answer: This analogy of a gift and its supposed conclusions seems to convince many, but it is greatly flawed.

First The free Gift is Faith to be saved by Grace and everyone is given a measure of faith at Birth. Romans 12:3 (KJV)  For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Secondly, to say that because it is a gift, and that it cannot be lost, does not have any parallel in human or spiritual experience. People are given gifts at many times within their lives and have become careless and lost them. Many have discarded gifts that they have been given in favor of something that they would rather have. The appeal that because this is a "gift" more accurately shows us the possibility that one can abuse what has been given to them. The same is true of salvation.

, We are told by the Scriptures that this "gift" of eternal life is intended and available to all. There are conditions that we must meet in order that we should be able to receive this gift, namely, repentance and faith. If there are conditions that are given in order to receive this gift, does it not make sense that these conditions must be present in order to retain the gift? If we cease to believe, and if we cease to repent and remain in our rebellion, we are in essence casting off this gift for something else!

"The gifts and calling of God are without repentance." This has been called into the service of those who desire to say that any gift of God cannot be taken away. The problem with this "proof-text" is context, context, CONTEXT! Before we take any Scripture and run with it, we must examine the meaning of that verse within its own context. To make any Scripture serve a purpose outside of what the author intended, is to dishonor God and the truth that He has revealed to us. To wrench a verse out of context is dishonesty, or at best, sloppy exegesis!

The setting of this verse in Romans 11:29, is the issue of the salvation of Israel in light of the Gospel being given to the Gentiles. "For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits, that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved......for the gifts and calling of God are without repentance." Romans 11:25, 26, 29. The context is that God has not turned His back on Israel. "God has not cast away his people which he foreknew." Romans 11:2.

Now, it is clear that not all physical Israel shall be saved, but only the elect the 1/3^rd. that make it through the fire of the tribulation and then are saved at Armageddon on Jubilee.l. Only by faith shall they be saved. "For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel.....that is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God." Romans 9:6-8. In conclusion, God’s gifts and calling to Israel are without repentance. His turning to the Gentiles for a time does not mean that He has reneged on his promises to them as a people. 

This verse has nothing to do with eternal security or the impossibility of God allowing us to cast away His gift of life! In fact, the CONTEXT paints an entirely different picture! We are told plainly that Israel was broken off because of UNBELIEF! Romans 11:19-24, "Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in.

Well; BECAUSE OF UNBELIEF THEY WERE BROKEN OFF, and thou STANDEST BY FAITH. Be not highminded, but FEAR: For if God spared not the natural branches, TAKE HEED LEST HE ALSO SPARE NOT THEE. Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them WHICH FELL, SEVERITY; but toward thee, goodness, IF THOU CONTINUE in His goodness: OTHERWISE THOU ALSO SHALT BE CUT OFF." We too must not become high-minded or we are in danger of being cut off too! If we stand by faith, and continue in His goodness, we have no fear of being cut off.

UES - We all sin each and every day. If we are not eternally secure, what does this mean? "Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling and to present you faultless before the presence of His glory, with exceeding joy, to the only wise God, our Savior be glory and majesty dominion and power, both now and EVER amen." Jude 24:25

EVG TV -   Answer: One thing for sure, this verse is a glorious promise to the believer in Jesus Christ! Another thing that is for sure is that this verse does not establish an unconditional eternal security! While it is true that God is ABLE to keep us from falling, both now and FOREVER, the passage does not say that He WILL impose this upon on any free being. He is ABLE to keep us from falling if we have faith in Him. He is not ABLE to keep the rebellious one who refuses to walk in the light and guidance that God has provided.

It seems confusing to me that those who contend that this asserts an unconditional security, and argue that they sin each and every day, would boast of this promise. If God is unable to keep them from falling in their daily walk now, how can He be trusted to present them faultless later? It is a dangerous thing to believe only what you want to believe from the word of God. If God is not able to keep them now, then He cannot be trusted to keep them later.

The most reasonable proof that this has nothing to do with this false security in sin is the context. We are exhorted in verse 21, to "keep yourselves in the love of God." God is ABLE to keep us upon the CONDITION that we KEEP OURSELVES in his love! Perhaps it would liberate some that read this.

Maybe they will see that God is ABLE to keep them from the sinful life that they have so eagerly defended in spite of the glorious promises of God to keep them from it! May they repent of their rebellion and unbelief in the promises of God!

It is finished!

UES - In the Greek, Christ's cry from the cross, "It is finished!" is an accounting term, meaning that the debt had been paid in full. Justice had been satisfied by full payment of its penalty, and thus God could "be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus" (Rom 3:26).

EVG-TV-    Answer: This is a fanciful approach to the idea of Eternal Security that has come into popularity in recent years. The argument seems like it is sound and is based upon the Greek term teleo which can be translated as "paid". This is a fact, and as a fact it cannot be ignored.

1. "In the Greek, Christ's cry from the cross, "It is finished!" is an accounting term." What we need to realize is that another important fact is conveniently ignored in this statement which is that the same word can mean finished, complete, accomplished, fulfilled, and to bring to an end. It is not always an accounting term as is implied by this post.

2. Because we have so many different meanings to this singular Greek word, we must look at the context to see which is the preferable translation. We must ask why no reputable translation of the Bible inserts "Paid in full" in place of "It is finished"?

We will now look at reprobation or Apostacy to see if it be true